Interview and Words by Jenny Schneider. 
​Edited by Jessica Sharrock.

A conversation with Dr. Sumru Bayin, Senior Postdoctoral Fellow at Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center (MSKCC), New York. See parts one, two and three here.
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PART 4: TIPS & ADVICE

JS: Any advice for international scholars on applying for funding?
SB: The website GrantScoop is a great search engine for funding opportunities. In addition, talk to your PI about it and contact your institute’s grants office (most big institutes have them). They can help you get more information that is specific to your field of research and nationality.
In terms of timeline, it is advisable to start looking for grants as early as possible because most of the grants have a specific window of eligibility (e.g. you can apply within 1-2 years of your PhD defense date). I think applying for grants is a great exercise even if you don’t need the extra funding or if you don’t get it at the end. It is beneficial for your CV, especially if you want to stay in academia, and it allows you to understand your own project from the start.

JS: Overall through your scientific experience, were there moments where you thought to yourself “I wish I knew this before”?
SB: I definitely wish I knew I had to contact PIs about rotations before my first day at the PhD program. I also wish I was more aware of the politics and competitiveness of science when I started my PhD. It can be brutal and unfair and it would of help to be ready to face it. Now I am used to it but during the first stages of my PhD I took it very personally, to the point where I thought I didn’t want to be in science anymore. If I had been prepared, I could have been more pragmatic and cared less about adverse reactions to my science.

JS: Looking back on your science path, would you do anything differently?
SB: I would say “no” to science more often. I still sometimes make the mistake of taking on too much. Overworking becomes a habit and if you don’t learn to make time for yourself from the start it is very hard to change later. I am a bit of a workaholic and I think that now it’s too late for me to change my habits. I wish I had set a better work-life boundary and remembered that science can wait sometimes!

JS: What is one piece of advice you would give someone starting their PhD or postdoc?
SB: Be realistic about your expectations, make sure that you really love science and that you are willing to spend the overtime on it. Definitely don’t go into grad school or a postdoc as a default; it’s the worst mistake. I am not saying you won’t be successful, you just might be miserable. Get into it because you want to do it, not because you don’t know what to do next. Also, if somewhere along the way you realize that it is not for you, it’s okay to get out and reconfigure your career path. In short, know yourself and know your limits.

JS: Moving from turkey to the US; what was the best, worst, and weirdest experience you have had?
SB: The best part was definitely New York City. Maybe I watched too much TV but NYC felt like home even when I first moved here. It felt so familiar, like I’d lived here all my life. It is multicultural and much more influenced by other world regions. As a foreigner, I think New York is very welcoming because of its diversity, no one treats you differently because everyone is a foreigner here. It is also one of a few select places in the world where you don’t have to define who you are.
The hardest part, scientifically, was dealing with the first round of disappointments from your project not working as expected in the lab. I also had to deal with some fallout from Hurricane Sandy, I think from my 8 years in the US; it was one of the hardest, most emotional experiences that I had to deal with. NYU got hit very hard and that put our lives on hold for a very long time. In retrospect, this experience strengthened relationships with my peers and eventually we bounced back.
The weirdest parts are the doors and locks opening the opposite way, and having to walk everywhere instead of driving. On a more serious note, seeing the amount of homeless people in NYC was difficult for me. I think in general, coming to a new country without knowing anyone is challenging. We put up brave faces but it can be hard at times. It helped that I acquired an extremely supportive group of friends during my PhD at NYU.
 
We would like to thanks Dr. Bayin for taking the time to INet NYC about her life in the science world.

Interview and Words by Jenny Schneider.
Edited by Jessica Sharrock

A conversation with Dr. Sumru Bayin, Senior Postdoctoral Fellow at Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center (MSKCC), New York. See part one and part two here.

PART 3: POSTDOC LIFE
JS: Did you consider doing a postdoc outside of the US?
SB: I did and I decided against it. People might disagree, but my personal perception is that once you get out of the US-science-niche it is very hard to get back in. A postdoc is the time to set up your network and create connections, whatever your future career may be. Since I wasn’t sure if I wanted to stay in the US long-term, I decided a postdoc in the US would keep the doors open.

JS: Did you consider doing a postdoc outside of academia?
SB: I did, though I considered it a bit too late. Industry postdoc applications usually have specific timelines (unlike academia). If I could do something differently, I would definitely look more thoroughly into industry postdocs. There are great programs (e.g. Novartis, Regeneron, and Genentech) in industry labs run by very successful PIs. Talk to people and ask questions about the lab publication record and get a feel regarding the level of autonomy you may have, if that is something that is important to you.

JS: How did you go about the process of looking for a postdoc? When did you start and what were your first steps?
SB: I started looking about a year before my graduation. Since positions at high profile labs get filled fast, it is good to apply about a year in advance, or at least send “feelers” out to the PI at that point.
I started searching for labs by reading papers and marking names of PIs whose research I was interested in, I also consulted my PhD committee members about my interests and asked their advice. I looked for open postdoc positions through Nature Jobs and I did get a few interviews from there, but the most successful applications came from personal e-mails I sent without knowing if they had a vacancy or not.
I think the e-mail you send to the PI makes a huge difference. Keep it concise and make it personal, don’t copy-paste a template. I stated why I was interested specifically in their lab as well as my general scientific interests. I attached my CV, references, and a short cover letter detailing my previous experience. I would suggest going to interviews even if it is not in your dream lab or subject, you never know what the lab really does and what the future projects will be until you talk to the PI.

JS: What are the most important questions to ask during the interview?
SB: We tend to focus on the fact that we are being interviewed by the PI and the lab, but it is also important to remember that a big part of the process is you interviewing them. Consider your future goals and ask how supportive your mentor will be with your career aspirations.
For me, it was important to ask if the PI assigns more than one person on a project as a competitive move- it’s a hard question to ask but it was a deal breaker for me. The second question I asked was can I take my project with me when I leave to start my own lab. This conversation needs to be established from day one if opening your own lab is in your thoughts.

JS: How did you pick your postdoc lab?
SB: More than my interest in the research subject, I looked into what I can learn from the lab, technique- and methodology-wise. I wanted to do something different to my PhD to develop new skills and get out of my comfort zone.

JS: Did you encounter any bureaucratic challenges in your transition from your PhD to your Postdoc institute?
SB: If you do your PhD in the United States, this transition is very structured and the school will usually guide you through your transition from an F1 visa to an OPT visa. However, you should definitely be aware of the process and monitor it to make sure everything is being done according to plan.

JS: In your opinion, what is the biggest difference between being a grad student and being a postdoc?
SB: The scale of responsibility! In grad school your mistakes are allowed. The expectations are high but when you do well the level of praise is commensurate. As a postdoc, even if you accomplish something very challenging it is usually met with… “Yeah, it’s your job”. You are expected to take charge which is not a bad thing, it is just an adjustment.
The relationship between you and your PI is extremely important (even more so than during your PhD). The success of your postdoc can definitely rely on the strength of your relationship with your PI because you don’t have the backing of grad school and your committee anymore. I am lucky that I have a great relationship with my PI but I can see with others how easily you can get lost in your postdoc without the proper support. 
On that note, when you apply for postdocs try to pick institutions that have a strong postdoctoral associations and administrative support for postdocs. Though in most cases things work out well, it is good to have backup and people to turn to if things get rough. Both my PhD and postdoc institutes (NYU and Memorial Sloan Kettering respectively) have a strong institutional support system for postdocs.

JS: Did you have any expectations from a postdoc and were they met?
SB: I had fairly realistic expectations, so the day-to-day life in the lab was what I expected. I also came from a lab where I was very independent and I had a lot of responsibility; in a way I was trained well for the postdoc. That said, I left my PhD program knowing everything there was to know about my work and my lab, and I entered my postdoc lab not knowing anything. Despite my independence and training, it caught me off guard but you get over it very quickly; it is part of the learning curve in any new job.
Also, I did not expect that I would be poorer than I was in grad school (says jokingly). You definitely don’t starve and your overall quality of life is higher, but your net salary after taxes, rent, and bills is slightly lower. This is also partially because we live in NYC where everything is more expensive. Lastly, one of the major adjustments for me was the social aspect. In grad school, you have classes and plenty of socializing opportunities within reach. As a postdoc, you go straight to the lab in a completely new institute where in most cases you know no one. I found it a bit difficult to make friends and build a community like the one I had at NYU during my PhD. MSK specifically has a slightly more “distant” feel to it since it is not a university environment. If you are the type of person who feeds off of other people’s energy, you should consider the overall dynamics and culture of the institute when deciding to join a lab.

JS: If you sum up your postdoc experience so far, what is the best and worst part about it?
SB: The best part is the science; I love what I do. My mentor knows my career goals and she is doing her best to prepare me for the next steps in my career. We have mentoring discussions that are preparing me and I appreciate that.
The worst part is the overall struggle of figuring out what I want to do next. Up until now it was fairly set, finish a PhD and start a postdoc. Once you get to the postdoc part questions start arising: Academia or not academia? If academia, what am I going to work on in my own lab? How am I going to handle it all? Even knowing I had years to think about it during my postdoc, I had those thoughts and questions about my next steps from day one; it is definitely a stress I put on myself.

Join us next week for Part 4, when Dr. Bayin will give us some tips and advice about being a graduate student and postdoc in the US.

Interview and Words by Jenny Schneider.
Edited by Jessica Sharrock.

A conversation with Dr. Sumru Bayin, Senior Postdoctoral Fellow at Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center (MSKCC), New York. See part one here.

PART 2: PhD LIFE
JS: You got into a PhD program on your second attempt. What did you do differently the second time around that you think influenced the outcome of your applications?
SB: A few things. First, I got better, more personal, recommendation letters the second time around. It is not enough to have a generic letter that says, “She was top of her class”. Second, I worked more on my personal statement. Your statement should show why you are interested in that specific institute, program, or lab. It is important to research the institute you are applying to and get as much information as you can through their website and by talking to people.
Not getting into a program does not mean you are not good. There are bureaucratic aspects that you may not be aware of that will influence the school’s decision, like quotas for international students, or budget restrictions for flying you in for an interview. Try to find out how many international students there are in the program or if the institute is familiar with students from your country. Overall, putting in the time to do research about the students and the faculty, and understanding the program and the University you are applying to can increase your chances of getting into your desired PhD program.
Also, when I applied I didn’t contact individual Principal Investigators (PIs) but in retrospect I should have. International students are often afraid of being too familiar with a PI and coming off as disturbing. But the worst that can happen is that you will not get a response. Get in touch with PIs to express your interest in their work, just make sure to do this in advance; a few months ahead of the application deadline would be best. 
Overall, at PhD level everybody is equally smart, so you need to find a way to differentiate yourself and show that you are adaptable and resilient. My summer research program in the UK definitely helped showcase my experience and get good recommendation letters.

JS: How did you pick your PhD institute and lab?
SB: It was partially luck for me. I had trouble establishing my first rotation because I was not aware that I had to start contacting PIs about rotations before I started the program. That is part of the challenge as an international student; you can be out of the loop. By the time I started reaching out to potential rotation labs all the rotation spots were taken. Luckily, the dean of our school told me about a new PI that just opened a lab the month before. I contacted the PI and it was a great fit. I ended up doing my first rotation there and eventually joined the lab full time.

JS: Did you continue your rotation project once you joined the lab?
SB: No. I loved both my rotation and thesis projects but they were not the same. That is one of the reasons I think that the project is not the most important part when picking a lab, as it often changes. It is important to talk to your PI about your interests and pick a lab where you will have a few projects to choose from. Most of the times things don’t work out like you thought and it is good to have back-up projects.

JS: What were the most memorable moments of your PhD experience?
SB: I had a great mentor that let me find my identity as a scientist and this led to an overall great PhD experience (although like most people, I had days where I hated everything and wanted to quit).
In terms of specific moments, I remember my qualification exam as the most challenging thing I did throughout my PhD; I left the exam thinking I knew nothing. On the flip side, I think my thesis defense was the highlight of my PhD. Towards the end of your PhD, you reach the top of your learning curve and you accumulate a lot of data. Then at your defense, no one knows your project better than you and that is your moment to shine and be proud of what you have accomplished. Another big moment is getting your first first-author publication; it is a great feeling of affirmation.
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JS: When did you know that you wanted to continue to a postdoc?
SB: I knew early on in my PhD that I wanted to do a postdoc because I want to stay in academia (for now, let’s see how it goes). Although, I think I would do a postdoc even if I didn’t want to stay in academia because it is an opportunity to understand what you want and it gives you time to consider your next steps.
I did consider skipping the postdoc entirely and going directly to a junior investigator program where you are supervised, but you have your own grants and freedom to direct your research. Eventually I decided against it because I didn’t feel ready to be that independent; I wanted time to learn and understand more about my own interests for my future lab.

Join us for Part 3, when Dr. Bayin will talk about how she went about landing her postdoc, how she chose the lab and her experiences so far.

Interview and Words by Jenny Schneider.
​Edited by Jessica Sharrock.

INet NYC sat down with Dr. Sumru Bayin, Senior Postdoctoral Fellow at Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center (MSKCC), New York. In this four-part interview, Dr. Bayin offers great insight and advice to early career scientists by talking about her personal scientific journey through Turkey, the United Kingdom (UK), and the United States (US). 
Dr. Bayin completed her Bachelors and Masters degrees at Bilkent University, one of Turkey’s leading institutes. She went on to get her PhD at New York University (NYU) and is currently a Postdoctoral Fellow at MSKCC.

PART 1: INTRODUCTION
JS: How did you decide to become a scientist?
SB: As a kid, I was one of those “freaks” who played with earth worms, dissected flies, and knew at the age of 12 what they wanted to do. I come from a family of STEM scientists, and although I was never forcibly pushed into that professional direction, it probably influenced my inclination towards science. In middle school, we had to interview someone who was pursuing our “dream job” and I picked a PhD student studying molecular biology and got to visit their lab. That experience was a crucial point in my decision to become a scientist and helped set my mind in that direction.

 JS: How did you pick your scientific field?
SB: I always found stem cells and their adaptability fascinating. Up until now I worked with liver stem cells, brain tumor stem cells, and now stem cells in the context of brain development. Honestly, I never thought I would work on the brain but I found it very attractive because there is so little known about it; it was the challenge that drew me to the field.
In general, when picking a field, I would say follow your gut and be aware that your interests may change over time. Follow a general interest and do not be too consumed with picking a specific subfield. At the start of my career, I was interested in Cancer Biology because of family history, but after finishing my PhD in the cancer field I realized I didn’t know anything about the function of healthy cells, so I moved into developmental biology research. Projects change all the time, so make sure you like the general theme and techniques. In a nutshell, listen to the science and see where it takes you. Try to see the big picture and don’t be too consumed with the little details although it is easier said than done.

JS: Can you tell me more about the time you spent doing research in the UK as an undergraduate student?
SB: The internship program I joined in the UK was similar to the Summer Undergraduate Research Programs (SURP) here in the US. While I was an undergrad in Turkey, I sent bulk applications to try and get into a program abroad. My application was eventually picked up by a lab that was familiar with the reputation of Bilkent University (they had a PhD student from my University in the lab, which I was not aware of when I sent the application).
It can be challenging to prove your academic merit when coming from countries like Turkey. Despite having world-class institutes with outstanding academic programs, the perception in the world can be skewed due to lack of familiarity. It helps to have someone to vouch for you and your home institution. That said, the challenge is mostly getting noticed during the application process. Once you are in the program no one will question your abilities and professionalism.

JS: Why did you decide to apply for a PhD program in the US?
SB: I was debating the US vs. Europe (EU) but I felt that the US had better-structured PhD training programs. Unlike most programs outside the US, here you get to do rotations and try different labs before you commit to one, giving you time to explore your options and interests more. Also, the education programs in Turkey are more similar to the American system than the EU system and this familiarity influenced my decision.

JS: Why not in Turkey?
SB: Despite the top-notch research going on in Turkey, it’s hard to compete with international level science simply because of logistics and geographic location, like the amount of time it takes to get an antibody shipped. I felt that if I decide to go back to Turkey one day, going back with a proven scientific record would make it easier to navigate the scientific community and have more of an influence than if I would try to build my career there from the ground up.

Join us next week for Part 2, when Dr. Bayin will talk about her PhD application process and life as a PhD student.